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October 05, 2006

Comments

Andrew

I have no way of comparing the relative corruption of the society where you live with that of my adopted home (Brazil). I do know, however, that it is rampant here.

My personal opinion is that corruption starts from below, and not from above. What are corrupt government officials if not normal people who take advantage of the opportunities presented to them by their political position. The everyday people who cheat on their taxes, pay to be bumped to the front of lines, and slip cash to police officers are just as corrupt--they simply do not have the opportunities that those in power have.

A Brazilian columnist recently asked why it was that newspaper dispensers (such as we have in the US, where you put in a coin and take just one paper) could never exist in Brazil. The answer is not corrupt politicians.

Rob T

Dishonesty and laziness are not learned - they are base traits of our fallen race. We have to learn to be honest and hard working.

Jim

Interesting quote there. There is a similar feeling in Latin America as well - the idea that "we just have bad blood" and so our situation is hopeless.

No doubt, as Rob put it, these are symptoms of a fallen race. On the other hand, this fatalistic idea that we just can't help ourselves - that we're somehow worse than other countries or races, seems to be to be equally dangerous.

It's interesting to hear a comment like that from another culture. I suspect it may not be an isolated feeling... what do you think?

Ben

Andrew's comment about the columnist's comment has had me thinking over the last couple of weeks. Why is it that a newspaper dispenser simply would not work in certain countries? As pointed out, the fault does not go to the politicians.

Is it a cultural thing? I don't think so. Really the only paper-stealing culprits would be the poor. So it seems to be more of a ratio between the net-worth of the robber and the "free" papers. If people in the States were to park their cars at the mall, leaving their keys in the ignition--I'd imagine the lot would empty.

Ten free papers is worth very little to the average U.S. citizen; but a 2004 BMW 5-series is a different thing.

Andrew

Ben,

Good observations. I am not ready to make the statement that it is the "poorness" of a culture that leads to widespread corruption. In fact, I would tend to think that the model works the other way around.

Here is another example: recently a missionary took some of our seminary students out to an "all you can eat" restaurant. As they were going through the line, the students heaped their plates full--way more than they could possibly eat in one sitting. When the missionary asked, they told her they were going to take the rest home.

These kids are not poor. Neither are they starving. There is just a cultural bent to taking every small advantage...no matter what the disadvantage it brings to others.

Another example of this is the driving here--which crosses all economic lines (and, in fact, most of those who own cars are upper middle-class to rich). I see people risk their lives and the lives of their passengers to gain a small advantage in a line of cars. I have witnessed ugly accidents because of this. There is not a day that goes by that I do not witness somebody doing something crazy on the road--something that would never be tolerated in the US.

While economics may be a player in the equation, I do not think it is the root cause.

Ben

Andrew,

Your examples of seminary students and driving hits home. I agree. Poverty does not equal corruption; nor does wealth. But I'm not sure if I'm ready to say that culture leads to corruption (not that you have implied this). This is a difficult topic, and I'm not sure there's a clear answer or cause--other than man's sinful desire(s).

However, I do believe that economics factor into corruption, with respect to how "sophisticated" the corruption plays out. Stealing papers? Very low. Probably only those w/ low economic status commit this act. Secret meetings between politicians and businessmen that specifically benefit the two? An act in which only high society dabbles.

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2009 Book List

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2008 Book List

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  • Leo Tolstoy: Master and Man and Other Stories (Penguin Classics)

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